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	SD! : Web boards : IE Theory : "vanilla tenderness and feelings" 1 2 3 4 vanilla tenderness and feelings (36) 26 Jun 08, 10:32 PM 662-935-655 US, 2 yrs Late last night or early this a.m i thought i saw a reply to this that asked the question how much communication went in to this situation? i can not find it now and when i tried to reply, being exhausted, found my reply just disappeared - don't know if that was my doing or not. But the essence of what i said to that is that i have noted that nowadays not much communication seems to be required in any sexual/romantic relationships - including some vanilla folks i've known ready to get engaged to men they knew only briefly via the internet. Fortunately, to my mind, most of them never made it to the altar. But i was fortunate in that i was married to the Man who collared me - may He rest in peace - for ten years and accepting the collar was my anniversary present to Him and W/we lived M/s 24/7 real-time for almost 5 years until He died about 6 mos. ago. FOR ME ONLY i not only don't think i could have done it without tenderness and love, but i really don't think i could have done it with any other Man as i have huge trust issues and with reason from my "'nilly vanily" prior life, oddly quite abusive in childhood and 3 prior marriages. i was blessed with what He Himself called a gentle Dom and was actually His cherished Baby girl but also better damned well do as i was told. from this experience oddly W/we both surmised that commitment and communication were as important and maybe more important than love. One of those Zen-like Paradoxes in life. i never cease to be amazed at the courage to love some of my fellow slaves and Masters of both genders in each C/category have to risk it all with F/folks they don't yet know all that well - i think it is passionate and beautiful but from my past life-experience i know for me it was also foolish in 3 out of 4 marriages, including this last one with the collaring as the 4th good one. it is because of my own track record that i doubt i could ever find the courage to try it again. Oddly i must echo a friend whose faith requires wives to submit to their Husbands as to their Deity and so on. she said once that she, if she had to submit, she was grateful that it was her SPECiFIC Spouse that she had to submit to. i agree with that - as my faith also requires submission but also because i don't think Anyone else could have brought me out of my whips-and-chains closet. i just don't trust easily. As i've said, He did do much of the stuff normally expected that the slave would do, partially because i am disabled, partially because He was and i expect He was bored, not working full time and not working at all at the last couple of years - i found that hard to accept at first, but also learned that to serve one must serve in the way the Master wants, not as i or someone else think i should serve. Even though locally this meant i was sometimes accused of "topping from the bottom". Yet what was not seen by T/those making such observations is that, though Master did it, He did it His way-period, no questions dared asked of Him about it by me. And that, for me, is where my slave's integrity lies. W/we did mostly D/s with little B/d and very little M/s - and it was me that thought at least that i wanted a little more of the latter two, but again, i wasn't there to meet my needs but His. i know i talk in circles and have trouble getting to the point, even told Master He might want to get me a gag and one for my finger-tips. And i know i probably express myself more than a slave "should" but was taught by Him that when i said "should" i was "shoulding all over Him and i" - a paraphrase of something from a book, i believe. but i am grateful to know my Master could give such tenderness and love as He did to His possesion - as He put it, His "treasure" which He considered it a privilege to maintain in top working order so it would remain a "treasure" (paraphrased, but close to what He said to me) i don't think it's any accident my health has gone to hell in a handbasket since He died - both my primary care provider and i believe my unconscious was holding out and keeping my body in working order for Him and has just given up since He died and the P.C.P.. and i are working on trying to get through to my unconscious mind as well as to work on the surface symptoms and ailments. Because i don't think this is what He would want of me- to just give up. He controlled me mostly with pleasure, praise and a bit of hypnosis here - which was most effective with this one, along with the communication and commitment. in my case He caught more "bees" with honey than with vinegar as the old saying goes and melted my resistance with ease that way. but once one has given one's word, what can one do except accept what one is and where one is or beg for release? UNLESS the Master can and will respond to one's needs - but with a new slave, i can see where a Master would be reluctant to do much of that as it could lose sight of Who is in real control and who is not, to appear to change the rules and give in. i think all any slave can do is make the best of it and maybe count one's blessings - i used to do this in writing and still do to keep a proper attitude. Maybe you might write up the 10 biggest things you like best about your Master and look at it when you get discouraged at the place you find yourself in? Okay, i know, i'm crazy. j/L Papa's owned always - still proud to wear His Collar (and ring) --- rest in peace beloved Master and Husband! 27 Jun 08, 12:13 AM MasterMattsslave CA, 11 mths Y! i know a lot of other people have commented, but i thought i'd give my $0.02 worth: i don't think tenderness is explicitly vanilla or lifestyle. It is not a solely vanilla feeling to want tenderness. It can exist in both areas, and i know that it definitely exists in Master and my dynamic. If there was no tenderness, no love, i would not be with Him. The idea of having my wishes not be important to Him is a big deal for me. The way it works with me is that my wishes and dreams are still important, but they come in second compared to what Master wants. He decides which goals i am to follow and which are not good for me. But were He to treat me simply as a possession, i would not be a happy slave. slaves have feelings too, and it is my opinion that there is nothing wrong with you for having different "emotional wiring" than your Master. It is also my opinion that this tenderness is something you care deeply about and so, no, i don't think it will be something easily forgotten about or gotten over. If you are looking for a different kind of relationship than the one you currently have, then the one you're in will never be satisfying. It can work, and you can be a good slave, but is it worth it? Will you be complete? Respectfully, nadia "I will love and protect you forever. you are worth any risk. you are not broken" (Master Matt) 30 Jun 08, 12:15 AM 000-446-713 US(KY), 4 yrs Y! MasterMattsslave wrote: The idea of having my wishes not be important to Him is a big deal for me. The way it works with me is that my wishes and dreams are still important, but they come in second compared to what Master wants. nadia, On another board, Master and i once saw a poster describe this in a way which resonated very deeply with Him, wich He now uses as His own. Decisions are made on this basis: needs/Needs/Wants/wants His properties needs come first, even before His own, because of His need to care for, provide for and protect the girl. properties needs, then His needs, then His wants, and and, last, her wants. her wants are not ignored, they are not unimportant. He may sometimes say He does not care, but that is symbolic language that turns us both on, and we both know the truth: He cares very, very much. But His wants come before hers - though her needs, (as He, in His wisdom, defines them) come before His. Edited 30 Jun 08, 12:16 AM by 000-446-713 30 Jun 08, 9:24 AM 688-764-833 US, 2 yrs I struggled with this at first. In the beginning, I thought that if he was not in “romantic-movie-love” it meant that I would be pouring my heart and soul into the relationship while he was much less invested and that scared me. This, however, was/is not the case at all. He also told me that he will never love me the way I love him, never need me the way I need him and while at first this worried me, I came to see that this was true and right: he most certainly should not worship me and think of pleasing me before himself. Also, I did not want an egalitarian relationship, why should I expect traditional expressions and feelings of love and tenderness from him? Does he love me? Yes, but not as his equal (and that's a good thing, to me). And I feel that love in many ways: the time he devotes to me, his pleasure in my successes, in the way he protects and cares for his property. Am I valued? Very much so. And when he tells me so it means so, so much to me. I learned to let go of wanting “vanilla tenderness” and instead began to appreciate the tenderness my master expresses, in the manner of his choosing. Usually when I tell him I love him he replies, “I know”, or “good girl”. Very, very rarely he will tell me he loves me but not until I first understood that he did not mean that he loved me as his equal. I hope you will find, as I did, that you will not need to learn to “tuck away” the desire for vanilla tenderness but instead those desires will fade and you will instead learn to love and crave the expressions of benevolence from your master in whatever form(s) they take. You're still learning each other: one day soon a certain smile or phrase of his may have more emotional resonance with you than every “I love you” you'd ever heard. Cheers, Leesie 30 Jun 08, 2:00 PM 391-117-605 US(WI), 10 mths 688-764-833 wrote: I struggled with this at first. In the beginning, I thought that if he was not in “romantic-movie-love” it meant that I would be pouring my heart and soul into the relationship while he was much less invested and that scared me. This, however, was/is not the case at all. He also told me that he will never love me the way I love him, never need me the way I need him and while at first this worried me, I came to see that this was true and right: he most certainly should not worship me and think of pleasing me before himself. Also, I did not want an egalitarian relationship, why should I expect traditional expressions and feelings of love and tenderness from him? Does he love me? Yes, but not as his equal (and that's a good thing, to me). And I feel that love in many ways: the time he devotes to me, his pleasure in my successes, in the way he protects and cares for his property. Am I valued? Very much so. And when he tells me so it means so, so much to me. I learned to let go of wanting “vanilla tenderness” and instead began to appreciate the tenderness my master expresses, in the manner of his choosing. Usually when I tell him I love him he replies, “I know”, or “good girl”. Very, very rarely he will tell me he loves me but not until I first understood that he did not mean that he loved me as his equal. I hope you will find, as I did, that you will not need to learn to “tuck away” the desire for vanilla tenderness but instead those desires will fade and you will instead learn to love and crave the expressions of benevolence from your master in whatever form(s) they take. You're still learning each other: one day soon a certain smile or phrase of his may have more emotional resonance with you than every “I love you” you'd ever heard. Cheers, Leesie Leesie, THIS....exactly THIS... is the response i have been praying for. You have confirmed what i am beginning to experience. Master does express His approval. He has suggested that He can love me, IN a different way. Thank you, Leesie, for revealing that what i hoped could be, indeed, can be. i already knew that traditional m/f relationship did not satisfy me; that's what caused me to seek a different way. my Master is kind person, considerate. He values relationships. He is very well rounded individual, who demands incredible effort from those in His world and He gives that and more. i do not regret my decision to move forward; a question posed to me by an earlier poster. i am grateful that i have found the Master i did. That you began your relationship with the same 'expectations' and have found satisfaction in what IS available, helps me tremendously. thank you again. emma Master J's naked bitch fuckslut slave and property that exits to please and serve Him. emma 1 Jul 08, 1:05 AM chuckhov US(FL), 2 yrs I think that is really beautiful! - Thank you for this... -Chuck 1 Jul 08, 2:40 AM 391-117-605 US(WI), 10 mths chuckhov wrote: I think that is really beautiful! - Thank you for this... -Chuck Chuck, WHAT is really beautiful? emma Master J's naked bitch fuckslut slave and property that exits to please and serve Him. emma Edited 1 Jul 08, 2:41 AM by 391-117-605 1 Jul 08, 3:38 PM jjsslave US(OH), 14 mths While its lear what your question is I find myself almost confused by it. Ive been living with Master for about 8 months now and all is well. I cant imagine wanting vanilla relations but I think its all in the mindset of the person. While we do have what others would consider as vanilla relations at times to me its all lifestyle related because thats how I feel inside. Tenderness is quite possible by a Master and i think its all in how you view it. Or at least I know it is for me. 1 Jul 08, 10:30 PM 964-996-026 FR, 3 yrs Hello i'm a french male slave owned by my Mistress. Mistress says the same thing to his slave : no vanilla tenderness. Before becoming a slave i feel romantic, and needs of tenderness. But now as slave of Mistress i agree with her Mistress must not show tenderness such as vanilla relationships this is an other process. In fact i find as slave that my needs are first acknowledgement of my slavery, to be appreciate as a slave. like U i did'nt find before tenderness satisfying in vanilla relationships. When Mistress established this behavior i firt find that i will be unhappy of that, now i know she was right. it is much more fulfilling my needs of slaveqns the slave loves his Mistress totally without restriction, and the slave loves to serve Her Mistress. Vanilla tenderness will be now something "bizarre" for me, i can't imagine that even if sometimes the slave would appreciate some tenderness, but the slave finally, and trustfully loves his Mistress like She is. Excuse me for my english, it's my first post here, the slave reads regurlarly here and find it very useful.... Many thanks. 662-935-655 wrote: Late last night or early this a.m i thought i saw a reply to this that asked the question how much communication went in to this situation? i can not find it now and when i tried to reply, being exhausted, found my reply just disappeared - don't know if that was my doing or not. But the essence of what i said to that is that i have noted that nowadays not much communication seems to be required in any sexual/romantic relationships - including some vanilla folks i've known ready to get engaged to men they knew only briefly via the internet. Fortunately, to my mind, most of them never made it to the altar. But i was fortunate in that i was married to the Man who collared me - may He rest in peace - for ten years and accepting the collar was my anniversary present to Him and W/we lived M/s 24/7 real-time for almost 5 years until He died about 6 mos. ago. FOR ME ONLY i not only don't think i could have done it without tenderness and love, but i really don't think i could have done it with any other Man as i have huge trust issues and with reason from my "'nilly vanily" prior life, oddly quite abusive in childhood and 3 prior marriages. i was blessed with what He Himself called a gentle Dom and was actually His cherished Baby girl but also better damned well do as i was told. from this experience oddly W/we both surmised that commitment and communication were as important and maybe more important than love. One of those Zen-like Paradoxes in life. i never cease to be amazed at the courage to love some of my fellow slaves and Masters of both genders in each C/category have to risk it all with F/folks they don't yet know all that well - i think it is passionate and beautiful but from my past life-experience i know for me it was also foolish in 3 out of 4 marriages, including this last one with the collaring as the 4th good one. it is because of my own track record that i doubt i could ever find the courage to try it again. Oddly i must echo a friend whose faith requires wives to submit to their Husbands as to their Deity and so on. she said once that she, if she had to submit, she was grateful that it was her SPECiFIC Spouse that she had to submit to. i agree with that - as my faith also requires submission but also because i don't think Anyone else could have brought me out of my whips-and-chains closet. i just don't trust easily. As i've said, He did do much of the stuff normally expected that the slave would do, partially because i am disabled, partially because He was and i expect He was bored, not working full time and not working at all at the last couple of years - i found that hard to accept at first, but also learned that to serve one must serve in the way the Master wants, not as i or someone else think i should serve. Even though locally this meant i was sometimes accused of "topping from the bottom". Yet what was not seen by T/those making such observations is that, though Master did it, He did it His way-period, no questions dared asked of Him about it by me. And that, for me, is where my slave's integrity lies. W/we did mostly D/s with little B/d and very little M/s - and it was me that thought at least that i wanted a little more of the latter two, but again, i wasn't there to meet my needs but His. i know i talk in circles and have trouble getting to the point, even told Master He might want to get me a gag and one for my finger-tips. And i know i probably express myself more than a slave "should" but was taught by Him that when i said "should" i was "shoulding all over Him and i" - a paraphrase of something from a book, i believe. but i am grateful to know my Master could give such tenderness and love as He did to His possesion - as He put it, His "treasure" which He considered it a privilege to maintain in top working order so it would remain a "treasure" (paraphrased, but close to what He said to me) i don't think it's any accident my health has gone to hell in a handbasket since He died - both my primary care provider and i believe my unconscious was holding out and keeping my body in working order for Him and has just given up since He died and the P.C.P.. and i are working on trying to get through to my unconscious mind as well as to work on the surface symptoms and ailments. Because i don't think this is what He would want of me- to just give up. He controlled me mostly with pleasure, praise and a bit of hypnosis here - which was most effective with this one, along with the communication and commitment. in my case He caught more "bees" with honey than with vinegar as the old saying goes and melted my resistance with ease that way. but once one has given one's word, what can one do except accept what one is and where one is or beg for release? UNLESS the Master can and will respond to one's needs - but with a new slave, i can see where a Master would be reluctant to do much of that as it could lose sight of Who is in real control and who is not, to appear to change the rules and give in. i think all any slave can do is make the best of it and maybe count one's blessings - i used to do this in writing and still do to keep a proper attitude. Maybe you might write up the 10 biggest things you like best about your Master and look at it when you get discouraged at the place you find yourself in? Okay, i know, i'm crazy. j/L Papa's owned always - still proud to wear His Collar (and ring) --- rest in peace beloved Master and Husband! 964-996-026 is owned by Reine Muriel 8 Jul 08, 2:46 AM chuckhov US(FL), 2 yrs To the O/P...! I know that all the warnings in the world will not spare you... because you will listen to no one. You sound very naive & "he" has had time to work your mind the way he wants it...Sadly you will have to learn the hard way. You need to either accept this, or *Run* just as fast as you can! I am Dom, and No Way would I ever want anything like that! Thank you, -Chuck Next page